Is the left on the right side

The left has made progress on the identity politics side which needs to continue but economically and politically the right successfully rolled back gains the left had made. A good example is the slow erosion of health care. 

The youtube video is illustrative of what I see as a failure to communicate (falling into right wing traps). This is another example of what JKR was pointing out. 

I meant to rewatch it before commenting again because there were other errors but I think the most glaring and pertinent was in response to the right winger bringing up Venezuela as an example of the damage socialism causes.  The left then launched into a pointless defense of Venezuelan socialism. 

I say pointless, because Venezuelan socialism has nothing to do what is proposed by the Labor Party in GB (or NDP style socialism). 

I would have responded: Socialism in GB is about paying for health care and roads and K-12 education collectively because it's cheaper than paying for it individually. 

We pay money for car insurance and house insurance even though most people never get a dime back.  We pay so that if we are the one hit with misfortune we can recover.

The left seems all tangled up in defending the ideology and addressing everything through a leftist lens all the time which is fine for leftists talking to each other but not for talking to the general public. 

Leftists often exude a sense of moral superiority that can be offensive. The attitude is "I'm going to inform you so you will understand that I am right about X so you should support me."

The right frames issues to show people how their lives will be improved by whatever policy.  The left more often frames issues to show people how they have to help people worse off than themselves. 

GND of QS made two really smart comment in a recent article that I consider excellent examples of the right approach. 

First, he emphasised that tackling climate change will make our lives better not worse. The left has accepted right wing framing that being environmentally conscious means giving things up that we enjoy or that make our lives easier and less expensive. 

When Trudeau says "balancing the economy and the environment" he sends the message that one is at the expense of the other. It's very effective communicating and reinforces the long-standing narrative that dealing with the environment means suffering economically while giving things up.

The other thing he brought up was how to pay for his proposals with a supporting argument for why those funds should be used to fight climate change rather than pay down Quebec's debt. 

My point is that there are ways for the left to communicate more effectively and gain the political power to change things either electorally or through mass demonstrations. By mass I mean a million people not 10K although 10K would be a good start. 

There are times when it is better to retreat and fight again another day and other times when it is better to plow forward. 

That is exactly what I have been sensing. The establishment left has decided a multipolar world is best. They want Russia and China to be a counterweight putting a check on US and NATO power. It's not that they think they are better countries. It's that they think multiple superpowers are better than a single superpower. 

So whenever topics come up critical of Russia or China the left jumps forth to defend them and accuse the West of demonization.

I've also seen the argument that we should only be critical of our country as if we have no right to criticize other countries until we reach some state of perfection. 

These attitudes when applied to politics help the right brand the left as supporters of dictatorships and authoritarianism. 

There also seems to be a disrespect for democracy unless people vote for what the left thinks is right. If people disagree their opinions can be ignored because they are brainwashed by the MSM or don't know enough to have a valid opinion. 

Another thread asks why fascism is on the rise, why the right is on the rise. It's because the left isn't trusted. 

I was propagandized here on the topic of China. Only Hong Kong and Taiwan saved me from being convinced that China was benign, unlike the US. 

Another wake-up call was Rittenhouse. The biggest wake-up call is Ukraine. The betrayal of feminists has long been depressing. The gigantic clown boobs on the teacher in Ontario and  trans women physically towering over other women in competitions, trans women raping other women in prisons and getting other women pregnant in prison, teens and young adults de-transitioning but left with physical changes and damage that can't be undone. All this will be laid at the feet of the left. Trans women do belong in women's prisons even if they haven't had surgery but it shouldn't be as easy as simply claiming to be a woman. 

There can be no discussion of this here:

https://bc.ctvnews.ca/trans-woman-who-complained-salons-wouldn-t-wax-gen...

or this

https://www.bbc.com/sport/rowing/63154925#:~:text=World%20Rowing%20curre....

or this 

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/health/tavistock-gender-clinic-lawyer...

Feminists have tried to sound the alarm of non-gender conforming kids being encouraged to identify as trans when they just might be tomboys or effeminate. 

The left dispensed with the concerns of women in favor of obsequiousness to the most extreme trans activists.

Prostitution also escapes leftist analyses in favor of blind support of sex workers.

If you really want to know why the left is losing it will be necessary to examine where the left is going wrong instead of blaming external factors.

Activists that take the most extreme positions should not be supported blindly. The left should keep an open mind and not assume activists represent their entire communities. I don't want to get too deep into discussing prostitution as we are discussing it in other topics. There are definitely mixed viewpoints in the trans community concerning the lack of careful assessment before being channeled into trans affirmative care. I'm not arguing that one or the other is necessarily right but that issues are not evaluated with an open mind and full analysis.

A more recent example is the faulty analysis of the war in Ukraine, not that the conclusion is necessarily wrong. The absence of proof is not proof. A couple of points being made central to the argument are twisted to the point of being not true. They totally undermine the rest of the argument being presented even if that argument is correct. It damages credibility on the left in a way that it does not on the right.  

The right, especially the far right, is accused of being in an unthinking feedback loop and propagandized. I agree, and I don't think the left is quite as far gone, but it doesn't self-challenge. it is in a feedback loop with automated responses rather than discussion. 

I am an abolitionist but that doesn't mean I hold the same views on how to get there as all other abolitionists or that they speak for me. I am definitely not responsible for everything they do or don't do. 

I take your point that there have been some discussions but nothing so controversial as discussing the pushing of trans identity on minors. 

That students don't care or aren't traumatized doesn't mean it isn't ridiculing women to the point of wearing blackface. It's also ridiculing people with gender dysmorphia. Males with gender dysmorphia want to look like women. I'd be fine if a person wanted to wear a dress and have a beard. Not so much cow tits. What next? Will they add a gigantic blow up dick in their pants? 

Scientists call their work theories, like the theory of evolution, a theory to allow for added discoveries to refine or even disprove it. Some theories are so developed like the theory of evolution that are supported by so much physical evidence we know it to be true, but dating has changed over the centuries as methods improved altering the theory

Simple definition.

ideology, a form of social or political philosophy in which practical elements are as prominent as theoretical ones. It is a system of ideas that aspires both to explain the world and to change it.

Leftist ideology has been turned into a religion. It doesn’t want its theories or logic questioned anymore because leftists have heard it all and have seen The Truth. No refinements required.

6079_Smith_W wrote:

Pondering wrote:

<p>I take your point that there have been some discussions but nothing so controversial as discussing the pushing of trans identity on minors.&nbsp;</p>

Pushing trans identity?

That was what members of the People's Party of Canada claimed was the problem  (that and grooming) when the Children's Museum held an event here two weeks ago. I was on the other side with the crowd doing our best to keep those haters at a distance. 

And there we have it. Exhibit A.  Shut down discussion immediately by implying the poster is associated with “haters” putting them on the defensive.

Meet Keira if you dare.

https://www.persuasion.community/p/keira-bell-my-story

The consequences of what happened to me have been profound: possible infertility, loss of my breasts and inability to breastfeed, atrophied genitals, a permanently changed voice, facial hair. When I was seen at the Tavistock clinic, I had so many issues that it was comforting to think I really had only one that needed solving: I was a male in a female body. But it was the job of the professionals to consider all my co-morbidities, not just to affirm my naïve hope that everything could be solved with hormones and surgery…..

Notably, a growing wave of girls has been seeking treatment for gender dysphoria. In 2009-10, 77 children were referred to the Gender Identity Development Service, 52% of whom were boys. That ratio started to reverse a few years later as the overall number of referrals soared. In England in 2018-19, 624 boys were referred and 1,740 girls, or 74% of the total. Over half of referrals were for those aged 14 or under; some were as young as 3 years old. The court noted the practitioners at the Tavistock did not put forward “any clinical explanation” for the dramatic rise in girls, and expressed surprise at its failure to collate data on the age of patients when they began puberty blockers….

The puberty blockers that I received at 16 were designed to stop my sexual maturation: The idea was that this would give me a “pause” to think about whether I wanted to continue to a further gender transition. This so-called “pause” put me into what felt like menopause, with hot flushes, night sweats, and brain fog. All this made it more difficult to think clearly about what I should do….

I started realizing how many flaws there had been in my thought process, and how they had interacted with claims about gender that are increasingly found in the larger culture and that have been adopted at the Tavistock. I remembered my idea as a 14-year-old, that hormones and surgery would turn me into someone who appeared to be a man. Now, I was that person. But I recognized that I was very physically different from men. Living as a trans man helped me acknowledge that I was still a woman….

Then there was the fact that no one really knew the long-term effects of the treatment. For instance, the puberty blockers and testosterone caused me to have to deal with vaginal atrophy, a thinning and fragility of the vaginal walls that normally occurs after menopause. I started feeling really bad about myself again….after a double mastectomy...

After I came to this decision, I found a subreddit for detransitioners. The number of people on it started rising, as if all these young women had come to a collective realization of the medical scandal we had been a part of. It was a place we could talk about our experiences and support each other. I felt liberated….

But former Tavistock practitioners have cited varied problems suffered by the kids who sought help, such as sexual abuse, trauma, parental abandonment, homophobia in the family or at school, depression, anxiety, being on the autism spectrum, having ADHD. These profound issues, and how they might be tied up with feelings of dysphoria, have often been ignored in favor of making transition the all-purpose solution….

Support for mental health care is thin and cures hard to come by. Transition fits the medication and surgery treatment model which is also very lucrative. Pick gender affirming care and you have a clear treatment model. We don’t yet know the numbers on how many people will regret transitioning over the next 30 years or so. It is a massive medical experiment that puts people on medical treatment for life that cannot be discussed without accusations of transphobia.

But you can hardly accuse me of not engaging with the points raised. I read your article and cited information from it. And I did in fact address your claim about not knowing the numbers around transitioning. In fact there is plenty of research.

But there is not plenty of research. The articles themselves all point out how limited the research is and how poorly tracked patients have been. There isn't even any evidence of a drop in suicide. We don't have long term information on transitions that started with puberty blockers. We don't have information on the results for people who did have versus didn't have bottom surgery. "Late onset" gender dysphoria is relatively new and doesn't seem to be tracked separately.

You're saying things like it isn't a mental disorder, but if it isn't a mental disorder there is no need for medical intervention because it isn't a physical deformity of any sort. 

When someone is homosexual attempting to change them is intervention be it conversion therapy or drugs. The intervention is unwarranted because there is nothing wrong with them medically. They just have a less typical sexual orientation. 

Gender reassignment surgery is a misnomer. It is plastic surgery and organ removal on medically healthy people followed by a lifetime of drug therapy. There is nothing wrong with their bodies. Surgery is not correcting anything and doesn't create new genitals or breasts. Gender isn't something that can be operated on. 

I accept that there are people with gender dysphoria for whom surgery and drug treatment are the only known successful treatments and they should receive it. 

Take 10 minutes to listen to Blaire White, trans woman

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z1ZWX5r_0MI&ab_channel=BlaireWhite

ryanw wrote:

young people aren't thick skinned and are under pressure to look good; how could anyone forget that? it's not transitioning at work here... so holster that smoking gun.

you could probably pull huge stats from young persons who aren't transitioning/NB, in terms of calorie restriction, exercise, disordered eating

and none of those numbers have to deal with the additional pressure to pass as their gender 

Another Blaire White video if you dare watch it.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DlC99jzz6f4&ab_channel=BlaireWhite
The Dark Reality Of Detransition: Regret & Activist Bullying

This was a girl put on blockers and hormones at the age of 15. Now 20 and balding with a deep voice he realizes he made a mistake. He is not detransitioning because he thinks he is too far gone based just on the hormonal changes.

It is not possible to actually change your sex. Messing around with hormones and cosmetic surgeries can help someone who is transgender to appear more like the sex they identify with and that eases the symptoms of gender dysphoria.

Even though the young person above was born female he doesn't feel he can transfer back after having been on testosterone for so long. Blaire went from male to female at 20 so it seems to me it should be easier for a female to revert to female than for a male to transition to female.

I imagine KC knows what he is talking about and understands his options. If he feels he can't detransition successfully there must be a reason.

Puberty blockers and hormone therapy are serious medical interventions with lifelong consequences including possible infertility. For a woman to take testosterone is not the same as the natural hormones that flood a boy's body in puberty.

Marc Emery started his crusading because doctors refused to give him a vasectomy as a young man. A vasectomy is easily reversable and he was an adult.

I don't call teens children but neither are they adults.
"young people aren't thick skinned and are under pressure to look good; how could anyone forget that?"
Exactly. Teen years are tumultuous times often leading to recklessness and confusion. Even the most loving teens are developing a personal identity separate from their parents who seem old and out of touch even when they are rock stars. Teens are finding out what their sexual orientation is and some are discovering they are gay or lesbian which are still othered in our society. Being straight isn't othered. I can see how easy it is for butch lesbians or feminine gays to be totally convinced in their own minds that they are actually normal straight men and women. They can't switch their sexuality so instead they switch their bodies.

To allow a teenager to risk puberty blockers and hormones and lifelong medical treatments and infertility when they are going through a tumultuous time seems reckless to me. People can transition as adults. It is true that some of the changes that occur in puberty are irreversible but that is the point.

Conversion therapy, trying to change someone's sexual orientation, does not work. It isn't a mental illness.

Gender non-conforming. Also not an illness. Same goes for gender fluid. They shouldn't be under the trans umbrella nor under LGBTQ unbrella at all. They are rejecting gender roles. It has nothing to do with sexual orientation or sexual identity.

Butch women may or may not be lesbian. Feminine men can be straight. Boys and girls are taught to stifle those aspects of themselves that don't match their sex, identified not assigned, at birth.

Because being male is positive girls have been able to get away with being tomboys and maintaining some masculine traits as adults. Boys are expected to stifle those aspects of their personalities even now.

I think that provides a clue as to why male to female was all we ever heard about for awhile.

It has to do with the left betraying feminists and not listening when we were sounding the alarm and still not listening. The left needs to get more reflective and open to ideas.

The only reason this trans conversation is happening is because I am not taking bait and de-transitioners are surfacing in large enough numbers to begin forcing the conversation. 

So are you going to attack these people Susan?

We are a group of lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender people, and allies, who want to ensure that all gender nonconforming youth—with or without gender dysphoria—are cared for and protected. We want to ensure that they’re supported in ways that prioritize their overall health and well-being for the long-term. In the current climate, media, “LGBT” organizations, medical and mental health professionals are downplaying the risks of early social transition, and medical treatment of children and teens with gender dysphoria. We want to consider those risks and the potential harm to both youth, who will likely be subjected to medical treatment they could have avoided if allowed to mature, and transgender youth, who are medically altering their bodies at younger ages. Our group supports nondiscrimination rights in housing, employment, schools, and marriage for all people....

The affirmative model is rapidly being adopted by parents with gender dysphoric children/teens, and is reinforced by many therapists and doctors, “LGBT” organizations, schools, and many in the culture at large. The image being promoted by these entities is that this is the fully accepted model in the scientific and therapy community. It’s not. It’s mainly promoted in the United States. Other gender clinicians in The Netherlands and Great Britain, for example, advocate for “watchful waiting” (“the Dutch model”), and express concern that the affirmative model may groom some children for medical transition they otherwise would have outgrown.

HUGE INCREASES IN YOUNG PEOPLE MEDICALLY TRANSITIONING

The second issue that has arisen in the last several years, is a huge increase of young people, particularly teen females, identifying as transgender and medically transitioning. This process starts as young as nine (girls) or eleven (boys), with the administration of Lupron (hormone blockers). This increase is due to a rise in visibility and reporting on trans issues in the media as the new civil rights cause, interactions of young people on social media, and the implementation of gender identity trainings by trans or “LGBT” orgs in schools. This is all viewed positively by trans activists and “LGBT” organizations....

In the past, there’s often been an unacceptable level of stress and difficulty in the lives of gender nonconforming children. This has to change. Life for gender nonconforming children can be very difficult, especially for children with dysphoria serious enough for a DSM diagnosis. Dysphoric children often experience persistent cross-sex identification and stress. Difficulties can include anxiety, depression, self-harming behavior, and suicide ideation.

If youths, who experience serious dysphoria, were all certain to eventually become transgender adults, this issue would be less controversial. If it were certain they would all want to permanently medically alter their bodies, in the way that affirmative protocols on minors do, this would be less controversial. Unfortunately, the reality is much more complicated, and this reality is often ignored in the way this issue is presented to the public (by media and entities that advocate for early social and medical transition of youth). Some children with gender dysphoria ultimately outgrow it. For this reason, many therapists, doctors, and LGB and trans people feel it’s unethical to enthusiastically support the social and medical transitioning of minors.

https://www.genderhq.org/trans-nature-vs-nurture-innate-gender-identity-...

Innate nature: Research supporting biological factors in trans & homosexual identities

Trans people have brains that are different from males and females, a unique kind of brain,” Guillamon says. “It is simplistic to say that a female-to-male transgender person is a female trapped in a male body. It's not because they have a male brain but a transsexual brain.” Of course, behavior and experience shape brain anatomy, so it is impossible to say if these subtle differences are inborn.

Susan, the people I am quoting support my view that children and particularly young women are being sent down the trans pipeline too fast and suffering lifelong damage because of it. 

They share my view that radical trans theory is confusing children and worsening gender dysphoria. Fears that effeminate gay boys and butch lesbians are being channeled into transitioning based on trans theory should be alarming to everyone. 

Disagreeing with radical trans theory doesn't mean being anti-trans or trying to deny their existence. That link leads to a long list of studies that discovered all kinds of ways in which male/female/gay/straight brains look different and alike. 

Our over the top gendered world is a major problem. It always has been and it has gotten worse. Gender expression should be practically non-existant. There is no need for boy toys and girl toys in stores. Manufactured consent comes to mind. Children want these gendered toys because they are groomed to. People are more the same than we are different. We just focus on highlighting the differences. We all feel the same emotions. Even gendered behaviors that lean one way or another overlap although women have had to fight to reject our "natural destiny". Some straight men are more nurturing than straight women. Some gay men are more brave than straight men. The gendered stereotypes complicate matters

That someone has a trans brain does not mean transition is the best option for that person. It might be but it might not be. The thing is the existence of a trans brain doesn't mean a sex change operation is possible. It isn't. The biological differences in genital construction are radical. Everything is all connected up. If a trans man and a trans women offered to switch parts it wouldn't work. Our reproductive systems are too radically different. 

Lots of drug treatments and surgeries can help a trans person appear to be the opposite sex but it doesn't make it so. It may still be the right answer for some or most trans people to switch but it shouldn't be assumed. Accidently scooping up effeminate gays and butch lesbians in the rush to affirmation is a serious threat. 

Here we go, another topic the left won't discuss.

Wagenknecht’s analysis is not entirely unique. In Denmark, the nominally center-left Social Democrats have rebranded themselves as a party that defends the welfare state, while it has lurched to the right on immigration issues.

Unless I am willing to have millions of people immigrate yearly I am not on the left.

Discussing the number of immigrants in social housing is racist even though that means there is a waiting list of 10s of thousands of people.

Hospitals collapsing? Let's raise immigration to 500K instead of 250K.  That will take the pressure off the health care system. Let's not forget the excess housing in Canada we have to fill with immigrants.

We are getting foreign students to pay full costs for education then we fast-track them for citizenship because they have Canadian credentials. We are brain-draining. Immigrants can also buy their way in again taking in the best and richest from other countries. 

Trudeau said straight up our economy is dependent on bringing in immigrants to grow.  No immigrants our economy collapses. 

Quebec is the ideal example of what is happening and the coming social unrest but the left will not discuss immigration from any perspective other than racism. Racism and xenophobia are the only possible reasons to discuss what people percieve to be the negative impacts on their lives and communities. Any other reasons are smokescreens. 

I started a thread on global migration but it is another thread that will go nowhere because left wing doctrine dictates that we are pro-immigration only. Immigration has no negative impacts because it is racist to think that their might be.  

I have predicted an increase in racist attacks although I didn't mention men will be the attackers because it goes without saying. White will still have most of the power 2050 but caucasions will be a minority in North America including Quebec. I am not against that. I don't have a problem with it.

I do have a concern. When I was in my late teens there was an influx of men from some South American country. One of them at a restaurant I worked at ordered me to meet him after work for a date. I said no of course and just thought "that's weird".  Another day only about a week later a man sat down at my table I looked up startled as their were lots of tables and he said, I'm eating with you or something to that effect. I told him if he didn't leave I would call the manager and he switched to a nearby table where he proceeded to stare at me until I left. A week or so later I was talking to another young woman and she explained that in the country they are from decent women don't go out without a man. Sitting in a restaurant alone was an invitation because I was the kind of woman that went out alone. That summer I was extra wary of men that looked like those guys. Was I racist? NO. Their colour was a non-issue. I feel like I have to say I dated a black guy to "prove" I'm not racist. Their culture was the issue. 

A young woman in Iran died because too much of her hair showed. Girls rose up in anger and anguish not caring if they too died. They died for freedom. Their classrooms were invaded and they were beaten for not submitting to the rules of men. This did not happen because of their gender, their gender identity, their gender expression, or anything at all having to do with gender. It is because we have vaginas.

That means we do not develop brawn in puperty no matter how many hormones we take. That means men can bow us to their will individually and collectively. This is something every woman walks through live knowing from a very young age. If we are lucky we can trust the men in our family, father, brother, uncle, cousins. The men that enter our homes and come for Christmas. Even if they are safe you could be raped by your brother's friend. The cute boy across the street could be a date rape. If you want to join the military or any other male profession, firefighter, police, even lumberjack, you have to decide if it is worth the extra risk. 

Hundreds of thousands of men from countries much more conservative than Canada are immigrating. Men from Iran and men from less but still conservative countries are immigrating. Russia and Ukraine are very conservative on LBGTQ+. Violence could rise. Conservative men will own more companies and be in power positions that reject us for sexist and homophobic reasons but unless they say so explicitly we have no recourse. 

I am pro-immigration. I am pro-refugee. I think we should increase our acceptance of refugees. We should be regularly off-loading refugee camps by X number of people per month so we will have a process in place for intergration. 

If we must have so many more sexist men in Canada I want stronger laws protecting women and LBGTQ+. I want laws requiring companies to have women on the boards and in executive positions. 

I went to counterpunch to see the list if authors to make a joke about needing affirmative action at leftist publications. I was right, there are women but less than a handful but a title caught my eye and made me laugh. 

https://www.counterpunch.org/2022/11/03/the-erasure-of-affirmative-action/

Only it wasn't about women. 

The erasure of race conscious admissions used in public and private universities began to its certain erasure today, October 31, 2022. For five hours, the United States Supreme Court heard arguments on the matter of Students for Fair Admissions v. President and Fellows of Harvard College and Students for Fair Admissions v. University of North Carolina. 

Saving Canada's welfare system requires talking about the burden being added by immigration. Replies about how they add to the economy are pointless if they don't add shelter spaces and social housing and beds in hospitals and seniors homes and smaller class sizes to aid in cultural conditioning. Yes I said that because cultural conditioning is happening and it is harmful to women and if you have a classroom with children from countries at war fostering acceptance and equality are valid cultural goals. 

• Far right leaders want immigration and temporary workers but pretend to be opposed to immigration while not actually doing anything about it. 
• Establishment left is pro-immigration only. 
• The social welfare system and health care systems are collapsing. 
• We are increasing immigration from conservative countries: Jamaica, Haiti, India.

as a party that defends the welfare state, while it has lurched to the right on immigration issues.

Yes because to defend the welfare state immigration has to be controlled.

With the deficit soaring and the welfare state creaking under the weight our only choice will be to turn to right wing economic policies limiting the welfare state. 

Women form 50% of the population. We vote. The left is ignoring the concerns of women and the 99% because the left has decided what we must all do. There is no need for discussion.