South Africa vs Israel

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JKR

The reality is I support a two state solution where a Palestinian state is established in Gaza and the West Bank as part of an overall permanent peace plan that insures permanent peace, security, prosperity, and sovereignty for both Palestinians and Israelis.

Paladin1

josh wrote:

More blah, blah, blah.  The reality is you support Israeli control of all the land between the river and the sea.  Your "peace" blatherings are nothing more than a cover for that.  When you say peace, you mean Palestinian surrender to Israeli control of the land between the river and the sea.

Confirmation bias. That's not what JKR has been saying at all. JKR can tell you 2+2=4 and you're going to argue with him. Why don't you just stop engaging in conversation (and I use that term lightly) and spam opinion pieces and twitter posts.

josh

You forgot to say, Hamas. 

Oh, and why don't you butt out.

JKR

Paladin1 wrote:
josh wrote:

More blah, blah, blah.  The reality is you support Israeli control of all the land between the river and the sea.  Your "peace" blatherings are nothing more than a cover for that.  When you say peace, you mean Palestinian surrender to Israeli control of the land between the river and the sea.

Confirmation bias. That's not what JKR has been saying at all. JKR can tell you 2+2=4 and you're going to argue with him. Why don't you just stop engaging in conversation (and I use that term lightly) and spam opinion pieces and twitter posts.

This conflict is actually very simple. It is like 2+2=4. This 75 plus year conflict is based on the Palestinian refusal over that time to accept Israel’s right to permanently exist in peace alongside Palestinians. That’s why Palestinian leaders for over 75 years have refused to agree to the establishment of a permanent peace agreement with Israel and instead have reserved the right to militarily oppose Israel’s existence and have in fact militarily opposed Israel. For over 75 years and counting Palestinians have said their ultimate goal is the destruction of Israel, whether sooner or later, whether through military means or any other means. In response to this military opposition to their existence Israel has changed the facts on the ground and said that the facts on the ground will continue to change if the Palestinians continue to oppose Israel’s existence. If Palestinian leaders accepted Israel’s right to permanently exist in peace they would long ago have proposed and supported a permanent peace agreement. Their unwillingness to do so says everything about their intentions and Israelis know this. Fortunately establishing a permanent peace agreement is still a possibility when there is sufficient will by middle of the road Palestinians and Israelis to establish a permanent peace agreement.

JKR

josh wrote:

You forgot to say, Hamas. 

Oh, and why don't you butt out.

Hamas’s ideology has been around for over a century going back to the Nazi Grand Mufti of Jerusalem Amin al-Husseini.

https://encyclopedia.ushmm.org/content/en/article/hajj-amin-al-husayni-t...

NDPP

Decolonize Palestine: The Myth of the Mufti...

https://decolonizepalestine.com/myth/the-mufti-helped-inspire-the-holoca...

"Pot calls kettle black..."

JKR

NDPP wrote:

Decolonize Palestine: The Myth of the Mufti.

Not a myth. A fact of history.

JKR

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The Mufti and his friend and comrade, the chief architect of the Holocaust, Heinrich Himmler, happily meeting in 1943.

NDPP

The Mufti & Hitler: Historical Facts & Netanyahu's Lies

https://www.newarab.com/opinion/mufti-and-hitler-historical-facts-and-ne...

"...Netanyahu's revisionism is meant to make the world against the Palestinians, at the height of the latest Palestinian uprising taking place against Israel's occupation.

Historical facts trump Netanyahu's claims. In truth, historians - including Zionists and Germans - studied the holocaust at length and left no stone unturned, and yet found not a single shred of evidence supporting Netanyahu's claims..."

 

Schoenman: The Hidden History of Zionism

https://www.marxists.org/history/etol/document/mideast/hidden/index.htm

Chapter 6: Zionism and the Jews - Collaborating with the Nazis."

JKR

NDPP wrote:

The Mufti & Hitler: Historical Facts & Netanyahu's Lies

The photos of the Grand Mufti and Himmler, the architect of the Holocaust, don’t lie. The photos of the Grand Mufti with high level Nazis don’t lie. The Grand Mufti obviously didn’t establish the Holocaust as that was done by Hitler, Himmler. Eichmann, and Goering. The Grand Mufti didn’t establish the Holocaust but he supported it.

NDPP

Probably also missing from your Zionist talking-point sources, is that Amin al Husseini was selected and appointed to his post as Mufti by his boss, Viscount Samuel Herbert, the first commissioner of British-ruled Palestine, the first Jew in the British cabinet, and a staunch and relentless Zionist advocate of a Jewish state in Palestine.

Then, as now, it was always a fixed game against the Indigenous Palestinians, with Zionist Antony 'I come as a Jew' Blinken, succeeding Samuel Herbert, for a new anglo-imperialist empire, making sure, once again, the scales still tilt in favour of the genocidal Zionist settler state that is 'Fort Israel.'

NDPP

An American Agent for Zionist Israel - Max Blumenthal on Antony Blinken @23:20

https://www.rt.com/shows/going-underground/587500-israel-killing-its-own...

"...This is someone who's been made US Secretary of State because of his Zionist lineage. He's the grandson of Maurice Blinken, one of the first Israel lobbyists in the United States, who set up a think-tank in the 1930s, and produced an influential paper on how Zionist colonization could be bountiful and productive in the historic land of Palestine.

He was raised by his stepfather, Samuel Pisar, who was himself a kind of Israel lobbyist, a constant in Francois Mitterand's circle and a kind of consigliori.

He was also a 'fixer' for the late Robert Maxwell, who was himself a Mossad-agent who got a de-facto state burial in Israel, and was also the father of Ghislaine Maxwell [Procuress, 'madam', felon and close associate of Jeffrey Epstein].

So Tony Blinken comes into his position, having gone to successive AIPAC conferences, telling them he 'inherited' his 'commitment to Israel's strength'. And that's how he got approved by the US senate in bipartisan fashion. And that's why he stands where he does, on Israel's genocide..."

Canada also has its Zionist agents for Israel...

The Reasons For Canada's 'Unwavering' Support For Israel

https://mondoweiss.net/2024/02/the-reasons-for-canadas-unwavering-suppor...

"Canada's remarkable fidelity to an apartheid state committing genocide is driven by imperial geopolitics, settler solidarity, Christian Zionism, the Israel lobby in Canada, and the weaponisation of antisemitism..."

DOWN WITH ZIONISM! DOWN WITH APARTHEID & GENOCIDE! DOWN WITH THE OCCUPATION! DOWN WITH CANADIAN COMPLICITY! FREE PALESTINE!

Paladin1

NDPP wrote:

DOWN WITH ZIONISM! DOWN WITH APARTHEID & GENOCIDE! DOWN WITH THE OCCUPATION! DOWN WITH CANADIAN COMPLICITY! FREE PALESTINE!

Don't forget it's not violence it's resistance.

epaulo13

Sevim Dağdelen: the double standards of the West are on full display at the ICJ

quote:

Does arming a state committing genocide make you an accomplice?

The arguments put forward by the German government in its defense were unconvincing. With a flood of PowerPoint slides, the German representation initially tried to play down the significance of Germany’s arms deliveries to Israel. It argued that the majority of the arms export licenses issued after October 7 were for so-called “other military equipment” (“sonstige Rüstungsgüter”) and only a relatively small proportion for so-called “weapons of war” (“Kriegswaffen”). This was an attempt to deceive the court and the public. For what the German defense failed to mention was the fact that this invented distinction between “other military equipment” and “weapons of war” is a specific feature of German arms export control. Contrary to what the terminology suggests, the category of “other military equipment” can also include weapons that can be used for warfare.

quote:

It’s not genocide, yet

It was striking that the German government did not even attempt to dispute Nicaragua’s presentation of facts about the extensive violations of international humanitarian law by Israel. Apparently, it also realized that the terrible humanitarian catastrophe caused by Israel’s war, which has killed more than 33,000 people, including more than 13,000 children, can hardly be denied.

The German defense therefore focused on the formalistic argument that the existence of genocide had not yet been established and that Germany could therefore not be found guilty of aiding and abetting genocide. In doing so, however, the German government fails to recognize the central obligation under international law that arises from the Genocide Convention – namely to prevent genocide. This is all the more significant as the ICJ issued protection orders in the case of South Africa against Israel in order to prevent the danger of genocide, which the court considered plausible. Even Israel’s blatant disregard of these orders to protect the Palestinian civilian population has not led to the German government abandoning its unconditional support for Israel.

This shows the absurdity and hypocrisy of the actions of the German government as well as the governments of numerous other NATO states: On the one hand, they ignore all the findings of the most important bodies of the United Nations about Israel’s most serious war crimes and the danger of genocide and, regardless of this, continue to provide unconditional support for Israel’s war. On the other hand, the German government and other Western donor states decided to stop funding UNRWA solely on the basis of unverifiable insinuations by the Israeli government about the alleged involvement of individual UNRWA employees in the Hamas attack on October 7, 2023. The requirements for subjecting 2.2 million people in the Gaza Strip, who depend on UNRWA aid for their daily survival, to collective punishment are apparently lower than for stopping the supply of weapons that could be used to commit genocide. This can hardly be surpassed in terms of cynicism.....

Paladin1

Question. How many of the 33,000 people killed in Gaza were Hamas?

JKR

NDPP wrote:

Probably also missing from your Zionist talking-point sources, is that Amin al Husseini was selected and appointed to his post as Mufti by his boss, Viscount Samuel Herbert, the first commissioner of British-ruled Palestine, the first Jew in the British cabinet, and a staunch and relentless Zionist advocate of a Jewish state in Palestine.

[/quote]

Glad to see you’re finally admitting Amin al Husseini was a horribly wretched leader! On this we agree.

NDPP

Video I Just Received (&vid)

https://twitter.com/AliAbunimah/status/1778818757055467980

"Berlin Police arresting the spokesperson of Jewish Voice For Peace in Germany, Udi Raz, as horrified onlookers shout 'Never Again!' amid scenes so reminiscent of Germany's Nazi past (present)..."

Justin Trudeau: Don't try this at home...!

[email protected]

STOP SUPPORTING APARTHEID ISRAEL'S GENOCIDE! SUSPEND ALL TIES NOW! FREE PALESTINE!

epaulo13

U.S. Vetoes Bid to Advance Full Palestinian Membership at U.N.

The U.S. was the lone veto Thursday on a U.N. Security Council resolution recommending Palestine’s full membership at the U.N. The U.K. and Switzerland abstained. All 12 other nation members voted in favor of Palestinian membership. Palestine is currently a nonmember observer. Riyad Mansour, Palestinian ambassador to the U.N., said the result will translate to a greater loss of life in Gaza. He spoke after the vote.

Riyad Mansour: “Our right to self-determination has never once been subject to bargaining or negotiation. Our right to self-determination is a natural right, a historic right, a legal right, a right to live in our homeland, Palestine, as an independent state that is free and that is sovereign.”

josh

Disturbing reports continue to emerge about mass graves in Gaza in which Palestinian victims were reportedly stripped naked with their hands tied, prompting renewed concerns about possible war crimes." --A new UN statement

https://x.com/NickKristof/status/1782766467609661671

epaulo13

APPLICATION OF THE CONVENTION ON THE PREVENTION AND PUNISHMENT OF THE CRIME OF GENOCIDE IN THE GAZA STRIP

quote:

Taking into account the views expressed by the Parties, and considering that each Party should be given a period of nine months for the preparation of its respective pleading, with the first time period to be calculated as from 26 January 2024,

Fixes the following time-limits for the filing of the written pleadings:

28 October 2024 for the Memorial of the Republic of South Africa;

28 July 2025 for the Counter-Memorial of the State of Israel; and

Reserves the subsequent procedure for further decision......

NDPP

Chief 'Mandla' Mandela: The Freedom Flotilla's Emergency Mission to Gaza & SA's Fight Against Zionist Apartheid and Genocide. (&vid)

https://twitter.com/dimitrilascaris/status/1783262907263750417

"Today in Istanbul, Chief 'Mandla' Mandela, the grandson of Nelson Mandela, delivered a speech to the participants in the Freedom Flotilla's emergency mission to Gaza.

Afterward, I spoke to Chief Mandela about the tenacious efforts of South African activists to strengthen their government's support for the Palestinian cause."

JKR

South Africa ranked among unsafest countries in the world – as citizens live in fear

https://businesstech.co.za/news/lifestyle/450267/south-africa-ranked-among-unsafest-countries-in-the-world-as-citizens-live-in-fear/

South Africa dropped in the latest index, with an index score of 57, and is now ranked the fifth most dangerous country out of the 144 countries covered.

It only placed above Liberia, Venezuela, Gabon, and Afghanistan.

josh

And that has to do with its action against Israel how?

JKR

The government of South Afica has an incentive to create diversions away from their failures in establishing for their people safety, security, and economic development.

If South Africa's goal was to help establish peace, they would support Palestinians and Israelis negotiating a permanent peace agreement. Instead they have been supporting Hamas.

josh

No, they've been supporting international law and opposing war crimes against Palestinian civilians.

Not to mention that Israel supported the South African white apartheid regime.

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